Dear all,

I have seen some of the arguments flowing between colleagues regarding remote police stations. I obviously support all their views that we need to revert back to the remote workings for both police stations and courts.

It is not news that cases are rising but whilst being here as Croydon duty solicitor today, numerous cases could not be produced from Walworth police station because the prisoners had tested positive for covid and therefore were appearing via PVL. So firstly if any of you have attended Walworth PS in the last couple of days should think about getting a test done.

Also whilst sitting here listening to cases there were just numerous issues clogging up the courts which had been adjourned for “ covid related issues” whatever that means!

Shofna Begum

Solicitor

Stewart Begum Solicitors

New London House

6 London Street

London

EC3R 7LP

Tel: 020 7036 0414

Email: shofna.begum@stewartbegum.co.uk

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From: members@mail.lccsa.org.uk [mailto:members@mail.lccsa.org.uk] On Behalf Of Keima Payton
Sent: 21 December 2021 11:56
To: Keima Payton <keima@paytonslaw.co.uk>; Elena Abraham <misselenaabraham@googlemail.com>; Liam Lane <Liaml@efbw.co.uk>; Margaret Frame <m2cframe@yahoo.co.uk>; ashley@ashleysmith.org.uk; members@mail.lccsa.org.uk
Cc: Members <members@mail.lccsa.org.uk>; 'listA@lists.clsa.co.uk' <lista@lists.clsa.co.uk>
Subject: RE: Stoke newington now making lawyers wear aprons or refusing entries

Barbara

Can they not just tell us not to panic and they are doing X or not tell us what they are doing but make it clear some work is in progress, meetings planned etc

I know there is little that they can do but they apparently have the support from TLS and each organisation so whilst they cannot force the police to allow remotes they could be saying that they are looking at options – discounting things they don’t think will work and maybe offering to employ a H&S expert to test the claims (get permission from police for such visits (where they can put their money where their mouth is) and do surprise visits because Nev is saying no problem and no problem is no notice needed!)

Hearing nothing after years of information is just upsetting and even you are guessing about what may or may not be attempted or suggested but you hit the nail on the head when you confirmed that the problem is “we have no idea…”

From: Barbara Hecht <bh@hechtmontgomery.co.uk>
Sent: 21 December 2021 11:45
To: Keima Payton <keima@paytonslaw.co.uk>; Elena Abraham <misselenaabraham@googlemail.com>; Liam Lane <Liaml@efbw.co.uk>
Cc: Margaret Frame <m2cframe@yahoo.co.uk>; ashley@ashleysmith.org.uk; members@mail.lccsa.org.uk
Subject: RE: Stoke newington now making lawyers wear aprons or refusing entries

I am no longer on the committee of the LCCSA but was historically. I think your criticism of the LCCSA is entirely unfair. Everyone involved is working voluntarily and it’s clear from the documents circulated that the police haven’t agreed the remote working which the LCCSA cannot be responsible for and that the LAA rely on the police decision re the protocol, again that the LCCSA cannot miraculously change.

The ideas that have been circulating regarding not accepting back ups have been raised in the last 24-48 hours together with some other alternatives.

We have no idea what meetings the LCCSA committee are having/discussions they’ve had or what attempts they are trying to make on members’ behalf to resolve issues in a fast evolving situation with this horrendous virus.

I’m sure we should be confident that all LCCSA office holders and the committee work in members’ best interests.

Barbara Hecht

Hecht Montgomery Solicitors

Van Gogh House

158 Twickenham Road

Isleworth

Middlesex TW7 7DL

Holborn Gate

330 High Holborn

London

WC1V 7QT

Telephone: 020 7112 9188 Fax: 020 7112 4993 Mobile: 07930 328091

Secure email: barbara.hecht@hechtmontgomery.cjsm.net

bh@hechtmontgomery.co.uk

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From: members@mail.lccsa.org.uk <members@mail.lccsa.org.uk> On Behalf Of Keima Payton
Sent: 21 December 2021 11:08
To: Elena Abraham <misselenaabraham@googlemail.com>; Liam Lane <Liaml@efbw.co.uk>
Cc: Margaret Frame <m2cframe@yahoo.co.uk>; ashley@ashleysmith.org.uk; members@mail.lccsa.org.uk
Subject: Re: Stoke newington now making lawyers wear aprons or refusing entries

I am really dissapointed that the LCCSA haven't been in contact to promote the idea of No back Up's or complain about the aprons and goggles.

This new president is silent, he needs to be on these issues reassuring us they are worth the membership!

First time ever I am considering leaving....

From: members@mail.lccsa.org.uk <members@mail.lccsa.org.uk> on behalf of Elena Abraham (via members list) <members@mail.lccsa.org.uk>
Sent: Tuesday, December 21, 2021 10:03:56 AM
To: Liam Lane <Liaml@efbw.co.uk>
Cc: Margaret Frame <m2cframe@yahoo.co.uk>; ashley@ashleysmith.org.uk <ashley@ashleysmith.org.uk>; members@mail.lccsa.org.uk <members@mail.lccsa.org.uk>
Subject: Re: Stoke newington now making lawyers wear aprons or refusing entries

I get that, the alternative would be to take pictures of the rooms and submit them to the expert. I’ve spoken to one agency who said they would provide a checklist after which they could assess the risk. The checklist coupled with pictures of the room may suffice. Again, just throwing some ideas out there.

On Tue, 21 Dec 2021 at 09:51, Liam Lane <Liaml@efbw.co.uk> wrote:

I think this is a great idea, but I cannot see them allowing access to a HSE expert in custody, particularly given the impact it may have. Which ironically probably proves the point that they broadly aren’t safe!

Liam Lane (he/him)
Edward Fail, Bradshaw & Waterson

From: <members@mail.lccsa.org.uk> on behalf of "Elena Abraham (via members list)" <members@mail.lccsa.org.uk>
Reply to: Elena Abraham <misselenaabraham@googlemail.com>
Date: Tuesday, 21 December 2021 at 09:26
To: "ashley@ashleysmith.org.uk" <ashley@ashleysmith.org.uk>
Cc: Margaret Frame <m2cframe@yahoo.co.uk>, "members@mail.lccsa.org.uk" <members@mail.lccsa.org.uk>
Subject: Re: Stoke newington now making lawyers wear aprons or refusing entries

Entering the chat late, but just had a thought that perhaps one way to approach this may be to instruct a health and safety consultant to attend on a police station case with one of us. A report from a health and safety professional may be just the thing to make our point. They may not take it from us but they can’t ignore it from them. If the report directly contradicts what the NPCC are saying then surely that changes things. At least our representative bodies would have something more concrete to put forward.

Elena

On 20 Dec 2021, at 11:44, ashley@ashleysmith.org.uk wrote:

But Maggie we should not have ever been placed in this position where we are considering playing cat and mouse games…turn up, go away, log in when you get home????

The core issue is that interviews rooms are not safe-period- everyone knows it- including the officers who tell you to wear goggles and an apron clearly.

We should not be put in this in position where we are trying to come up with a plan where we can assist our clients, be compliant and be safe…this was thought out in March 2020 and resulted in the protocol.

Ros

Ashley Smith & Co Limited
Registered Office
Romer House
132 Lewisham High Street
SE13 6EE

Tel: 020 8609 6711/6710

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From: Margaret Frame <m2cframe@yahoo.co.uk>
Sent: 20 December 2021 11:35
To: ashley@ashleysmith.org.uk
Subject: Re: Stoke newington now making lawyers wear aprons or refusing entries

Maybe if you say not wearing that if they refuse entry if don’t you could say I will deal remote and I’m not passing case back.

That has got to be possible.

Get client on board. They will not like us turning up like that!

They can’t trust us if we dress normally if there is Perspex or glass seperating us but we can appear like something out of an apocalypse movie and they will be reassured? Really!!

For goodness sake!

Sent from my iPhone

On 20 Dec 2021, at 11:21, Margaret Frame <m2cframe@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
An Apron and gloves. This could make a really funny sitcom in a few years time!

What is happening!

Will the police, the client and AA all be wearing this?
Sent from my iPhone

On 20 Dec 2021, at 10:59, ashley@ashleysmith.org.uk wrote:
That get up will hardly be conducive to good communication and best advice…particularly if you have a vulnerable client with issues!

This is so much nonsense…if these measures are believed to be required then any one thinking of health and safety would make remote an option.

Someone please remind me why our representative professional bodies are not standing up to the NPCC on this?

Ros

Ashley Smith & Co Limited
Registered Office
Romer House
132 Lewisham High Street
SE13 6EE

Tel: 020 8609 6711/6710

CONFIDENTIAL CLAUSE

IMPORTANT - This email and any attachments are intended solely for the use of the intended receipient. It may contain private and confidential information or material that is privileged. If it has come to you in error you must take no action based on it, nor must you copy or show it to anyone. Please contact the sender if you believe you have received this email in error.

This Firm is Authorised and Regulated by The Solicitors Regulation Authority No: 654874
Registered at Companies House Cardiff Company No. 11535905

From: members@mail.lccsa.org.uk<members@mail.lccsa.org.uk> On Behalf Of Nadia Ryman
Sent: 20 December 2021 10:38
To: Liam Lane <Liaml@efbw.co.uk>; Sanjiv Bisnauthsing <sbisnauthsing@hotmail.com>
Cc: members@mail.lccsa.org.uk
Subject: RE: Stoke newington now making lawyers wear aprons or refusing entries

Croydon advised me over the weekend I was required to wear a mask apron gloves and goggles………… I asked if we were partaking in a science experiment………

From: members@mail.lccsa.org.uk<members@mail.lccsa.org.uk> On Behalf Of Liam Lane
Sent: 20 December 2021 10:36
To: Sanjiv Bisnauthsing <sbisnauthsing@hotmail.com>
Cc: members@mail.lccsa.org.uk
Subject: Re: Stoke newington now making lawyers wear aprons or refusing entries

Because what does an apron protect? How is an apron more protective than remote advice?

I don’t feel any safer wearing an apron, I just feel ridiculous!

Liam Lane (he/him)
Edward Fail, Bradshaw & Waterson
<image001.png>

From: Sanjiv Bisnauthsing <sbisnauthsing@hotmail.com>
Date: Monday, 20 December 2021 at 10:29
To: Liam Lane <Liaml@efbw.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Stoke newington now making lawyers wear aprons or refusing entries

Forest gate too. However if this is protection with mask why not!!!
Sent from my iPhone

On 20 Dec 2021, at 10:28, Liam Lane <Liaml@efbw.co.uk> wrote:
Yet dont allow remote attendance....

Liam Lane
EDWARD FAIL, BRADSHAW & WATERSON
662-664 Commercial Road, London E14 7HA
DX: 300701 Tower Hamlets
Tel: +44 (0) 207 790 4032
Fax: +44 (0) 207 790 2739
Secure Email: liaml@efbw.co.uk.cjsm.net
Website: www.efbw.co.uk
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Liam Lane (he/him) Edward Fail, Bradshaw & Waterson	<image001.png>